* Author Topic: 2nd IVF/ICSI DHEA short protocol Menopur/Gonal F bfp low hcg medicated m/c 6wks  (Read 7191 times)

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Offline KandK

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The link to my first diary is in my signature so past cycle and history are all there.  In summary it was ICSI, 3 day embies with assisted hatching, 2 x grade 2ab day 8 cell embies transferred but BFN with chemical pg and hcg of 9.2 at 11dp3dt.  Hoping for a BFP this time.  Also I am a bit wiser (damn and yes older!) for this cycle - I kinda felt like a dog being taken to the vet for the last cycle, like the cycle happened to me and I didn't have much say in the matter 'cos tbh I didn't really know what was going on, each stage just happened iykwim?

For the most part the tx is going to stay the same, short antagonist protocol and same clinic.  We were going to change but I think it is wiser to stay with them for now.  The only thing different will be I am self-prescribing DHEA (see my old diary for reasons) - well not really self-prescribing as DH is an ob/gyn so I am not flying blind without advice.  He will also do a uterine scratch before this cycle.  This is a quick simple procedure and is done twice during a cycle, once in the follicular phase and again in the luteal phase.  The reason is the endometrium heals the sites where the scratch was done and it leads to a better lining and higher chance of implantation. 

I am also taking 25mg of DHEA 3 x daily (so 75mg in total) and started that on 15.01.2012 and that should be enough time to improve eggs quality as we are planning to start this 2nd cycle in April.  I wanted to record any side effects/benefit/reactions to the DHEA because I found so little actual patient experiences of people taking it so hoping this helps others who go looking for the same info I did!

Just for the record I am also taking the following - folic acid, fish oil, evening primrose oil and magnesium and this was the same during my last cycle.  The only thing different is the DHEA.  I still have the 5 kgs to lose that I was trying to lose before last cycle, lol.  Just to add insult to injury I added another 3 kilos to that during last tx so now I have a grand total of 8 kilos to lose  :(  I am motivated and it is giving me something to focus on otherwise I would just mope and get depressed about last cycle.  Will update as things progress.

Offline KandK

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Re: 2nd IVF/ICSI this time with DHEA
« Reply #1 on: 22/01/12, 11:19 »
One week exactly since starting DHEA and something is def happening!  I had read that it takes 2-3 weeks to notice effects but one week in and I have just starting getting pimples on my chin, I never get pimples and even as a teenager they were rare and if I got them it was just one small spot.  It is not so bad, I can manage it with retinol cream (I know it is not good when pg but I am a long way off that yet!).  Also as far as weight loss goes it's wonderful, 2.3 kilos in one week  ;D  I am having the same low carb diet that I usually eat so no difference there, I can't exercise much just some light weights as usual as well.  So no change really to diet or exercise but good weight loss, could it be the DHEA?  Who knows, there are reports of it helping with lowering body fat and increasing lean muscle but I am a bit skeptical it could be working this quickly?  It is also supposed to increase libido, I hope for DH's sake it doesn't 'cos I don't really need that  ;D  Let's hope the next 5 kilos is just as easy then I will be very happy.

Offline KandK

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Re: 2nd IVF/ICSI this time with DHEA
« Reply #2 on: 21/02/12, 14:26 »
I haven't posted for a while, been trying to forget all things IVF for a while cos it really seems to mess with my head.  We had our follow-up appointment with on 06.02 and found out a few things.  He was surprised I wasn't pregnant as everything with the cycle seemed to be good.  I asked about the low no. of eggs retrieved and he said he was unsure of that himself as my estradiol was apparently 3000 which is supposed to indicate that at least 15 eggs should have been able to be retrieved, but he had no reason why it was only 9 and out of that 6 were "usable".  I am still convinced it was the initial high dose of menopur that caused that (6 vials so 450iu). 

I am booked in for a hysteroscopy on 16.03 - he suggested that they have a bit of a look in there to make sure that there is no pathology (polyps, myomas etc) that may have caused our negative result.  It isn't costing us anything and will be done at his private clinic so hubby can be there and also be part of it.  They will do the endometrial scratch at the same time so now just waiting for this really.

I still haven't got my period after the last bleeding :(  I bled last on 12.01 and it is now 21.02 but my periods are usually around 34 days and also the bleed on 12.01 wasn't really a period more an early pg loss so I am not sure what to expect really.  It is due any day now according to symptoms I have been having though - when it comes I will begin bc pills (Yasmin) just to regulate my period so I can bleed according to schedule as we have a long distance to travel to these IVF appointments and can't rely on my period to do what it should on the date required!

As for the DHEA I am still taking it and have noticed no side effects apart from mild skin changes but nothing that is major and can be easily controlled - just hope it is doing something for the egg quality.  I only have 180 tablets which is 2 months worth (3 x daily).  I am unsure if I will order more as I am hoping to undergo the next cycle earlier if possible.  The dr said you can do it first cycle after failed tx if you want and that we don't have to wait for 1 or 2 cycles like I have read with others.  Maybe it is because I am on short protocol?  Will update as tx or tests are done.

Offline KandK

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Re: 2nd IVF/ICSI this time with DHEA & Menopur/Gonal F
« Reply #3 on: 25/02/12, 09:12 »
CD3 (tx day 1):

Hahaha what a difference a day makes!  One day after the last post we suddenly decided to try again for this cycle and not wait for the hysteroscopy and do it in April/May.  I was going to start BCP/OCP when I bled but the opportunity came to do it earlier so we took it.  So now I am on CD3 and had my scan today and got my meds.  Got a bit of a shock because the Dr said during the last cycle we will do the same thing again next time, but nooooo!  I am now taking 150iu Menopur and 300 Gonal F.  Last time it was 450iu Menopur only.  I hope these changes are a good thing, just I won't be able to compare the difference DHEA made (if any).  Speaking of which I am continuing to take it, I was a bit worried about taking it during stims but I read a lot (well there isn't a lot really!) and found this article which seems to advocate to keep taking it http://www.ivfnewsdirect.com/?p=1408  so I will give it a go.  As for side effects, I was reading about others saying it made their skin itchy, well I just thought it was the water at home but for the past few weeks my skin has been very itchy particularly my scalp but also abdomen and legs.  Also have to wash my hair more than usual as it seems to get greasy very quickly which is weird for me as it is normally dry.

I don't return to the clinic for 3 days and hubby won't be here for another week :(  so I have one long week in front of me, at least it has stopped snowing so I should be able to take some walks and I bought the whole Underbelly series when I was in Aus last time so I can watch that at least.  Wish I was one of those women who loved shopping as I am surrounded by shops, but I would rather go to the dentist than walk around the shops!  ^idiot^  I have also downloaded some relaxation apps and I will make a point of doing that several times a day, as I am a bit of a worrier, especially when I am by myself like now.

It is weird being back here and going to the hospital again and doing injections again!  It feels like so long ago that I was there last but really it was only early January when I had my ET.  I am not a big believer in fate but so many things aligned just right to indicate I should do the cycle now instead of late April/early May.  During my 2ww (I am hoping to get that far!) I will be in Europe so I am hoping we find out there that I am pg, especially when we go to Holland as it is where my dad was born so we are  ^pray^ ^pray^ ^pray^ to get a positive result there!  Time for some sleep and hoping these follicles are getting busy and growing  ^reiki^

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Offline KandK

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Re: 2nd IVF/ICSI this time with DHEA & Menopur/Gonal F
« Reply #4 on: 28/02/12, 09:02 »
CD 6 (tx day 4)

Had the scan this morning to check how the follies are going.  Damn why do they sit and make you wait so long with your knickers off and feet in stirrups before they come in, then the long dramatic pause while they poke around your bits before they actually tell you what they see?  ^bigbad^  Had a nice dr today who spoke English quite well so that was a relief!  I seriously have an immature side left over from teenage years I think as he said to me quite earnestly that my ovaries are very rich and that we can make good babies together  :o  yeah well you're kinda nice and all but I think I prefer to make them with my hubby, no point changing horses midstream  ;D   I had to try so hard not to laugh and keep a straight face as he went over my meds.

On the serious side though he found at least 15 follicles (on average 8-10mm size with 4 dominant ones at 10mm) and expects more over the next few days as he said the ovarian reserve is looking very good.  I am hoping now that I have the lower dose of Menopur (so less LH) that those follicles will all have eggs in them and not like last time they were empty/cysts - I have read that initial high doses of LH can cause this (Menopur has LH as well as FSH).  So same meds 300iu of Gonal F and 150iu of Menopur but tomorrow start Cetrotide.  Two days later I will be back for another scan.

I have noticed I am not as bloated this time as I was last time, maybe because I am trying hard to avoid the carbs (a big cause of bloating for me) and I am doing well on the protein - lots of eggs, full cream milk, cheese and fresh fruit and veg (and chocolate....).  Drinking as much water as I can but it is hard when it is cold and snowy to chug it down!  Froze my butt off waiting 20 mins for a taxi in the snow this morning, ah gotta love peak hour in Istanbul in the snow :)  Off to fill in some time, reading pages and pages of other ladies diaries which is great.  To anyone out there on the IVF/ICSI journey or about to start I will you all lots of luck  ^reiki^

Offline KandK

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Re: 2nd IVF/ICSI this time with DHEA & Menopur/Gonal F
« Reply #5 on: 29/02/12, 10:51 »
CD7 (tx day 5)

Why am I posting one day after the last one......... B O R E D . C O M!!!!!!!!  I am such a lazy slug, I spend all day in bed (almost!) and my dvd watching has finished so now I am pointlessly googling everything and even then I am running out of things to research  ^idiot^  Hubby leaves for Ankara today, two more days before he will be here, I will be so glad to see him!  I don't like going out here alone not only cos it is cold and snowy but I don't speak the language so everything is just harder.  I am a little sad cos tomorrow is an important anniversary for us and he won't be here  :( (cue violins and book a table for one at the pity party  ;D) but he is off getting visas for our trip to Europe and it can't be helped.  S'pose I should update on tx, still taking 300iu Gonal-F and 150iu Menopur and today started Cetrotide.  I think things are happening because it is getting a bit full and tender in the ovary area and the EWCM is pouring out (sorry! should have tmi alert).  I am a bit tired and headachy, probably cos I am not sleeping so well by myself - such a sad sack aren't I but I miss DH.

I am eating well and getting in lots of protein and keeping away from carbs but can't seem to drop the coffee, well it is usually only 2 sachets of premix so pretty weak really, not like I am down the road in Starbucks sucking down proper espresso - too lazy to get out of bed and go there probably!  Tomorrow another scan so I am hoping these follies are doing what they should be.  I am still not so bloated, there is some but it is tight and not squashy like last time - although I think last time I was eating too many carbs so I think that was to blame.  I have been reading diaries and some of them you really need the tissues handy, so many BFP's sadly ending in MC around the 8-9 week mark - I will be packing it if I do get pg until I deliver I think!  It makes me sad we IVF ladies can't seem to enjoy being pregnant like others can, we know too much and that knowledge is always lurking in the background not allowing us to relax.  Well off to pointlessly google things and twiddle my thumbs until DH arrives, at least I have to get out tomorrow to get the scan, pretty sad when that is the highlight of the day  ^idiot^

Offline KandK

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Re: 2nd IVF/ICSI this time with DHEA & Menopur/Gonal F
« Reply #6 on: 1/03/12, 08:43 »
 ^swear^ what a  ^swear^ morning!  I am nearly ready to  :'(  don't know if I am more angry or upset!  Was I hormonal at this stage in my last diary?  I woke (IN PAIN!) and then shortly after got a phone call from DH and he was being a silly prat.  He is at a friend's house in Ankara and I swear they were acting like 12 year olds calling their girlfriend  >:(  Lots of giggling and general teenage behaviour and he barely spoke to me, just had immature side conversations with his mate.  Then he hung up and rang back 5 mins later, but more of the same behaviour so I hung up!  Honestly how old are you lads  ^bigbad^  I was angry 'cos it is our anniversary today and not even one mention of it or even asking how I was.  I got ready and left my phone at the house cos it was flat and also cos I didn't want to hear from him until he grows up!  So out the door I went to get the scan - I was hopeful because I woke in such pain this morning, so I am on now:

CD8 (tx day 6)

It was snowing again (cos I had to get a taxi no doubt!) then the taxi driver took me the 'long way' just to rip me off, should have smacked his fat  ^swear^.  Anyway got to the hospital and had the scan, well the doctor was a right you-know-what.  Not so much as a hello and not once did he even look at me or even talk to me!  5 second brief conversation with the nurse (in Turkish I have no idea what he said) then out the door.  Well  ^swear^ you too!  I think it was bad news :(  I asked the medication nurse (who speaks some English) but she couldn't really understand what I was asking, she said 'oocyte question?' and said they might get 8 or 9 :(  :'(  I nearly cried right then!  I am doing my meds right, I am shoving protein down my gullet like there's no tomorrow, what happened to them all, where did they go????  :-\  Last scan the dr seemed so happy and hopeful (different dr this time though).  When he was scanning I was looking at the screen and I couldn't see many black splodges, last time I saw heaps of them wtf is going on???   He only measured 2 of them and the screen measurement said 8.9mm  ??? I don't know what is going on as 2 days ago they were 8-10mm  :-\

Well I got home and tried to go to the shops (to buy some chocolate  ;D ) but they were only letting staff in so I had to either sit outside in the snow or go home.  In Turkey shops don't open until late (between 10-11am) so I got angry and stomped off home.  Walked past the grog shop and that was open!  Sorely tempted to go in and get a bottle of vodka but resisted.  Got home to 2 missed calls and 5 messages from DH.  I sent him a rather angry message and then shut my phone off, I need to calm down a bit before I turn it back on 'cos really I am about to cry and  ^bigbad^ someone now so it is best to be alone I think.  So same meds again and 2 days later I will get another scan.  Off to check my old diary to see if I was an aggressive hormonal demon at this stage last time  ::)

Oh pants, I just checked my last diary and things were so much better then (and even then only 9 eggs even though lots of follies) :(  last time there were soooo many follicles, they reduced my meds and they also did an estradiol test - today no bloods were taken and I am on same level meds (450iu of fsh) I think this is going pear shaped  :'(

edit - 3 hours later:
I am feeling a little better, calmed down and bit and called DH.  He is trying to be reassuring but honestly nothing will make me feel better right now.  I know I should just put on my big girl panties, get over it and harden the f up and that so many ladies would be happy to be getting ANY response and eggs... but I am pinning so much hope on this cycle being the best cos after this I am not sure what will happen.  The bank account is haemorrhaging and we have nothing but huge expenses coming up so maybe this could be it :(  I was so hoping this would be a good cycle and that we could have embies to freeze as well, now I am just sitting here wondering wtf went wrong and where did all those follicles on the scan 2 days ago go?  Just sit and wait for the next scan I guess, at least DH will be with me for that one as he arrives tomorrow.  Off to wallow in self-pity....  ^eyes^

Offline KandK

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Well I was a right proper cow in the last post huh?  Feeling a bit better today emotionally but physically whoa am I a bloated whale!  I feel so full and heavy :) and I inserted a smiley cos I think it is a good thing!  I don't care what that silly doctor saw I know I am full and ready to pop so I am sure there must be plenty of eggs in there!  Hormones must be high as the EWCM is still pouring out (sorry  ::) )  I look very big in the tum now and spent the day in my stretchy trackies because it is quite sore and I even found it hard walking to the shops (yes I got my chocs, lol, well I got more than one cos I had to make up for not getting any yesterday  ;D ).  Hubby is here in 4 more hours!!! I am really looking forward to seeing him and having some company, I am climbing the walls here atm with boredom!  Did my shots as usual today but when I looked down at the three puncture marks I was shocked to see blood oozing out of one and fluid out of the other two!  Damn, sprung a leak  ;D  too many holes I think!  So of course off to Doctor Google to see why and apparently it is normal, although I have done 2 rounds now of injections and the first time this has happened  ???  Will update tomorrow after the scan, and I know we will see something good  ^reiki^

Offline KandK

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Well well well looks like my follies came back home  ;)  different doctor and DH present this time during scan and whaddya know seems like things are looking good  ::)  either the nurse read my file wrong (saying only 8 or 9) or there was some huge mis-communication somewhere along the line between dr, nurses and me.  Had bloods done and I am touch and go for EC, looking like triggering tomorrow but have to have one more scan because it is 50/50 whether they leave it one more day.  Still on same meds, DH isn't so sure about that and neither am I really but have to wait for scan to see.  So not all doom and gloom, but bl**dy hell they sure put a crazy hormonal woman through the wringer!  Lining is looking great and follies all 'round, so hoping they don't mess it up and I ovulate early 'cos it is looking ready to go with some quite large follies.  Crossing everything and  ^pray^ ^pray^ ^pray^ hard for best "harvest" ever!!

Offline KandK

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CD 11 (tx day 9)

Had the scan this morning and all looking good so will trigger tonight with Ovitrelle and drug free day tomorrow!  Today is only Cetrotide so feeling good not to have to do Meonpur and Gonal F although, annoyingly it means I have spare drugs which I won't use :( unless I cycle again and hoping and  ^pray^ this doesn't happen.  Will update after EC, hoping so so so much that it is a good number so more chance of little ones to pop in the freezer!  ^reiki^ ^reiki^ ^reiki^ ^reiki^ ^reiki^ ^reiki^ ^reiki^ ^reiki^

 

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