* Author Topic: Using ICSI with donor sperm??  (Read 1284 times)

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Offline Kittycatjellyfish

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Using ICSI with donor sperm??
« on: 18/09/14, 20:50 »
Hello,

I'm hoping someone might be able to give me some advice.  I'm currently doing IVF with donor sperm as I'm single.  I'm at the down regulation stage. 

I recently received my invoice for treatment, in which was included the ICSI procedure.  I did not agree to having this procedure.  During my initial consultations with both the Doctor and Nurse there, we discussed the ICSI procedure and agreed it was not needed as I was going to use donor sperm.

I first spoke to the clinic about using a donor there a few months ago when I was planning what to have done, and they informed me they only had donors with poor sperm, therefore I would need to have the ICSI procedure as well.  I declined this and agreed to source a donor from elsewhere with ‘normal’ sperm count, motility, mobility etc.  In doing this I have obviously paid a substantial amount of money, but it was my decision to do this rather than go with the ICSI procedure with the clinic.

I also read in their literature that ‘ICSI is a micromanipulation technique used to help couples where there is a known male factor component that is reducing the chances of achieving a pregnancy.  Some men have a low sperm count and in these cases the sperm are often not strong enough to enter the egg by themselves.’ 

So now they are saying actually I do need to have ICSI afterall, even though the sperm is not substandard.

I contacted the clinic and was told they may need to use the procedure and this was what was stated on the information that came with the donor sperm.

I have contacted the donor sperm company – who have told me there are no instructions recommending ICSI that they are aware of, however if the specimen is below the quality standard at the time of thawing (which is rare, but does occasionally happen) the clinic can file a specimen complaint form with them. 

I also took advice from an outside fertility doctor, who said there should be no reason why ICSI is needed, unless there is a problem with the sperm. 

I am extremely upset that the clinic have gone back on what we initially agreed and are now saying I may need to use ICSI.  At £1200, this is a cost I cannot afford on top of the £8,500 I am already paying.  I had heard that IVF was a very stressful process but did not expect this stress to come from the clinic that are supposed to be helping me!

I made a complaint and have received a reply from them saying basically they feel the sperm may need ICSI as apparently a lot of donor sperm is substandard once thawed.  However, they accept my wishes not to have it done, so they won't do it, even if this compromises the chance of success!  I feel like they're holding me to ransom.

Has anyone else had experience of this?  I thought buying donor sperm would mean the sperm was good to use, unless in exceptional circumstances.  It just seems really unfair the clinic have told me initially I didn't need ICSI and are now saying if I don't have it, it may harm my chances of conceiving.  I'd really appreciate any advice anyone can give me.

Best wishes, Kitty

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    Offline bobbinhead

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    Using ICSI with donor sperm??
    « Reply #1 on: 18/09/14, 22:13 »
    hello im having ivf with donor sperm. my clinic have said they will only do icsi if once thawed there is less than 5 million as thats their policy for ivf. If less than 5 million on the day i will be given the option to do icsi and somehow magic the money or abandon the whole thing. Sadly i dont have the option to go ahead without icsi if there is less than 5 million when i think i should be able to make that decision.  I dont see why they are trying to force you in to it before they even know the quality/quantity of the sperm it should be a decision made on the day. I would put your foot down as it could be totally un needed and a waste of your money.

    Offline Kittycatjellyfish

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    Using ICSI with donor sperm??
    « Reply #2 on: 19/09/14, 18:11 »
    Hi Bobbinhead,  Many thanks for your message.  I will speak to them again and say I want to be able for them to make the decision on the day.  Maybe if ICSI is needed, we can claim back some of the money from the sperm bank??  Or am I wishful thinking?

    Offline Bumble Bus

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    Using ICSI with donor sperm??
    « Reply #3 on: 19/09/14, 19:29 »
    I can see why you are annoyed as your clinic haven't been particularly transparent with you but I would say there is another side to the icsi story (this is all with donor sperm btw and same donor) -

    In my first cycle I got 5 mature eggs, and 3 fertilised with normal ivf (ie 60% fertilisation rate) and I got 2 x 3 day embryos

    In my second cycle I also got 5 mature eggs, and all 5 fertilised with icsi (ie 100% fertilisation rate) and I got 2 x blasts

    In my third cycle I got 7 mature eggs, all 7 fertilised with icsi (ie 100% fertilisation rate) and I got 3 x blasts

    Icsi is not soley used for sperm issues.... as you can see my clinic used it to increase my fertilisation rates which for me was crucial as I don't get tons and tons of eggs.

    Don't want to confuse you further but just thought something else to throw into the mix.  Best of luck with your cycle.

    Offline bobbinhead

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    Using ICSI with donor sperm??
    « Reply #4 on: 19/09/14, 19:30 »
    Not sure how much luck you would have there. My clinic have made me order 40 million sperm yet told me to be prepared for possible icsi. So i am also worried about how much you really get. Im not sure what you can do if your clinic say not enough sperm or the sperm isnt as advertised. I havnt found any info on cyros about what i can do if that happens, so would just email them and see what happens.

    Offline bubbabooboo85

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    Using ICSI with donor sperm??
    « Reply #5 on: 21/09/14, 15:37 »
    I can completely understand you being annoyed after being given conflicting information!

    I have just had ICSI with donor sperm and i was told by my clinic that it is thier policy to always use ICSI for frozen sperm and it is generally not as good quality because of the freezing process.

    Hope it all works out for you.

    Boo xx


    Offline Kittycatjellyfish

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    Using ICSI with donor sperm??
    « Reply #6 on: 17/10/14, 12:16 »
    Hi All,
    Many thanks for your messages.  I spoke to my clinic and told them I wanted to make the decision on the day, whether to use ICSI or not, depending on the quality of the sperm once thawed.  They were ok with this.  I was prepared to pay the extra £1200 for ICSI if needed. 

    The clinic apologised for the fact they had given me conflicting information and said they have since re-written their literature to explain better.  I think they really need to write some literature about using donor sperm (e.g. where to obtain it, what the process entails etc) as currently they just include a paragraph in their literature.

    Also, I have read conflicting reports about the use of ICSI.  Some studies have shown higher rates of chromosomal abnormalities through the process.

    Luckily, they did not need to use ICSI as the sperm thawed well.  I got 6 eggs, resulting in 4 embryos and currently looking at 3 x day 5 blastocysts.  Embryo transfer is tomorrow!  Fingers crossed.
    Many thanks again. xx