* Author Topic: Natural, mini, mild (etc) IVF chat thread  (Read 69998 times)

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Offline CrazyHorse

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Natural, mini, mild (etc) IVF chat thread
« Reply #130 on: 16/06/15, 18:32 »
A mild/mini IVF cycle might help you with the follicle maturation. I was on 2.5 mg letrozole twice / day and 75 iu Menopur once / day for my mild cycle, with no GnRH agonist (e.g., buserelin) or GnRH antagonist (e.g., Cetrotide) except for a small amount of Cetrotide at the end to keep me from ovulating early. This gave me good-sized follicles with very minimal side effects. Some clinics also do Clomid or Letrozole on its own with no injectables.

Given your FSH, I'm guessing you still have some decent quality eggs left. Low-dose stims might get you over the hump of not growing mature follicles, without damaging your egg quality. I see that you had a 0% fertilisation cycle years ago, but that could have been down to sperm issues or a problem with the lab -- I wouldn't necessarily assume poor egg quality by default. Do you mind if I ask which clinic you're with now?

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    Offline Briss

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    « Reply #131 on: 16/06/15, 19:12 »
    RiftRaff, could this just be a one off anovulatory cycle? 13 mm is a bit small. do you know what's your estrogen levels? if they are high you may still have an egg there. i'd see if this follicle ovulate and if you have progesterone levels ager O and if so I'd try again next cycle.

    I am doing completely natural IVF + IMSI. my last cycle was super natural we even did not use trigger shot so it's just progesterone after EC. I had a few cycles where we had to abandon it cos of early ovulation or missed ovulation/LH surge or missed egg at EC, this happens all the time with natural IVF. you have to know your body quite well and help the clinics sometimes cos everyone is different. but the good news is once you get the egg it has a very good chances of fertilisation and implantation. I have zero fertilisation with stims (any stims) but on natural cycles my eggs usually fertilise although i never had more than one egg collected.

    Offline Pickle123

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    « Reply #132 on: 22/07/15, 14:25 »
    Hey team mini/mild/au naturel, and hello to all the lovelies I know from other threads!

    I'm doing a natural modified cycle package with Create. I'm on cycle 1 and had my first scan today (day 4). What size follicles would you expect to see this early on without any stims? Also, what about lining thickness?

    Thanks!
    Pickle   :)

    Offline Briss

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    « Reply #133 on: 22/07/15, 14:55 »
    Pickle, day 4 is very early for natural. I do not usually start scans before day 8-9. Although at Create when I had my modified natural IVF I had my scan on day 6 and had 6 follicles: 1 right/ 5 left; 11 mm; 10 mm; 7 mm; rest below 6 mm, my lining was 5.78 mm, estrogen 295, LH 5.6. I was on 150 menopur from day 6 so this result was before I started injections. I ended up with one dominant follicle and one smaller runner up which was not collected due to cyst nearby. One egg, 2 day transfer but that cycle ended in chemical. I do not know if my numbers are any use to you though but may give you some idea. Good luck!

    Offline Pickle123

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    « Reply #134 on: 22/07/15, 17:21 »
    Hi Briss, and thanks, that's really helpful. What are you doing treatment-wise at the moment? Hope you're doing well :)

    Offline katkat2014

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    « Reply #135 on: 31/08/15, 11:20 »
    Hello everyone, I know that this thread has kind of died down but in the hope someone reads it and can help.. I am thinking of doing mild IVF as I seem to have an egg quality issue. What drugs and protocol do you think would work for me? So far a clinic suggested a chlomid cycle. Another suggested Menopur. What is the difference between the one or the other in terms of results? My AFC is 10 (but 20 were counted a few months ago), FSH about 8.5, LH about 4, lowish testosterone (taking dhea now). So I have always responded fairly well to stimulation, but on the long protocol with Gonal f only I had almost no mature eggs and on the short protocol with gonal f and Menopur I had only 2 good quality embryos and 3 bad quality ones. Do you think mild or natural IVF could be an option?

    Offline Orchid-1

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    « Reply #136 on: 31/08/15, 14:56 »
    Hi Katkat - personally I would steer clear of clomid. I have been told it wrecks havoc with your ovaries.
    - mild or short protocol without down regulation [i.e cetrocide] is generally thought to be better for ladies who are older.

    Natural IVF - don't know too much about that. Perhaps some of the other ladies can help.

    I have been recommended menopur which I will be using for my next cycle. I don't know if it will work or not. Fx anyway. Hope it all goes well for you too. x


    Offline CrazyHorse

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    « Reply #137 on: 31/08/15, 15:22 »
    I think the bigger issue with Clomid is that it tends to cause the uterine lining (endometrium) to be thinner than normal. If you normally have a thick endometrium midcycle (e.g., 12 mm), that's not a big deal, but if your midcycle lining is on the thinner side (e.g., 9 mm), having it thinned out further by Clomid can be problematic. Letrozole (aka Femara) is a good substitute for Clomid for women who have problems with thin uterine lining and/or migraines.

    The consultant who treated me at Reprofit was very big on using either Clomid or letrozole in combination with a low dose of Menopur, and said he believed they got much better results using the drugs in combination than either alone (you can see in my post upthread what doses I was on), and his opinion was that Menopur was superior to Gonal-F for this particular protocol. They did their mild protocol with no GnRH antagonist (i.e., Cetrotide) except at the very end as needed to avoid possibly ovulating before egg collection. Variations of this protocol are often also called Japanese mini-IVF because, like vitrification, it was originally pioneered a decade or so ago by Japanese clinics. :)

    Offline katkat2014

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    « Reply #138 on: 31/08/15, 18:28 »
    Hello orchid and crazy horse,  that's really interesting, thanks! Currently unsure if I should stick with my clinic or change, but the other clinic I was looking at (Serum) suggested chlomid but with embryo freezing and banking. My lining is on the thin side, around 8.3 or 8.7 the day before trigger. Apparently that is fine for implantation ...  not sure if that's correct... now am starting to wonder if perhaps my lining is too thin for implantation..

    The Menopur/femara combo - when did you start taking cetrotide (what size follies)? On both my long and short protocol they gave it to me from around day 6 of stimulation even though my eggs were just smallish (2 days later on day 8 the largest was 15.7mm).  Just wondering if taking cetrotide too early could be bad.

    With mild or natural IVF you obviously get less eggs. I keep on reading of women having blastocysts transferred on this protocol. Did your clinics recommend to transfer day 2 or 3 or did you have a choice to wait till day 5?

    Offline ScaryButExciting

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    « Reply #139 on: 31/08/15, 18:56 »
    Katkat -

    Recent research shows that anything above 6mm! is good enough for implantation, that thickness is not as important as they thought in the past...

    Cetrotide prevents ovulation and as far as I understand does not impact maturing of eggs if on a short protocol... They start administrating based on LH spike, with me already on D4 of stimming both times, but had plenty of mature eggs...

    Lastly, I believe clinics offer you blasts based on number of embryos on day 3... Getting embies to blast is done to aid selecting of the strongest looking... If you have a limited amount of embies and/or it is clear which ones look the best clinics will normally transfer on day 2 or 3... If you have lots of embies and they all look the same letting them mature to blast helps the selection... But as you always lose about 50% in the process it is only helpful to select...

    I am considering mild for my next cycle... Have been to open day at Creatr and have follow up in start of September...