* Author Topic: Low AMH / High FSH Cycle Buddies - Part 6  (Read 124928 times)

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Offline katkat2014

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Low AMH / High FSH Cycle Buddies - Part 6
« Reply #1950 on: 12/02/19, 15:27 »
Shady, I am really sorry, I was hoping a few days silence meant there as a positive somewhere. Some of us have had the chance to transfer 2 blasts and somehow most of us got a bfn when transferring 2 blasts. I still cannot help but think what if one was good and the other wasn't... Dr Brosens always says that one can bring the other one down when the body is fighting to get rid of the one that has the bad cells. Did you not have another 1 or 2 frozen you could transfer first (I thought you had 3 or 4 in total but I may be mistaken)? Immunes are such a minefield. I really do rate Dr Brosens and Quenby, but the only thing they look at is uNK cells. But what I really like about them is that they do it for research purposes. And you can return again and again for free scratches (I have done about 4 by now; they use the material for research and I get a free scratch out of it and they know what they are doing, I trust them entirely). I agree with you on Dr G! Dr Brosens just said (when I told him I went to see Dr G)  that I should just look at the car Dr G is driving vs the car he is driving and then I know where the money goes   ???

Poppy. I am sorry you're so frustrated with the waiting but I hope your call tot he doctor tomorrow will tell you otherwise.

Queenie, hope all went well!

AFM, so lining was 6.5mm at the thickest spot, but 5.9 and 5.7mm at the other measurements taken, so I cancelled voluntarily. That is after taking vaginal viagra daily, l Arginine, Vit e, lots of other supplements, cycling daily, one acupuncture, etc etc. The quest for the good embryo has turned into the quest for the good lining! I guess I have 3 options now. First, do the same again starting on a higher dosage. Second, do a down-regulated cycle with higher estrogen. Third, do some kind of stimulated cycle like nat modified just to add some gonal f or whatever at the end and hope it stimulates my own natural estrogen production. I have a few questions, maybe one or the other knows the answers: 1) Does anyone know if a down-regulated cycle is supposed to help lining growth, or is it just a matter of keeping follicular development at bay and being able to go on for longer before starting progesterone? 2) I have never done a natural modified cycle. On a natural cycle my lining is on average 6mm, but at times it goes up to 7/7.5mm. What does it entail? I don't want many eggs (although I will try and collect one), but I would want a better lining so I can transfer one of my blasts. 3) Remind me, does letrozole thin the lining (ie could I do a letrzole & gonal f cycle)? 4) is Menopur better or Gonal F better to produce more estrogen?

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    Offline ShadyWheat

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    Low AMH / High FSH Cycle Buddies - Part 6
    « Reply #1951 on: 13/02/19, 09:07 »
    Thank you Helen and KatKat, it sucks doesn't it when you have no idea what's going wrong - or that it could be any of a million things!

    Helen, amazing you are thinking of another OE cycle. I actually have more faith in your eggs than I do in mine! I think you've been remarkably unlucky so far to have transferred so many good blasts and not have a baby.

    KatKat, haha, I never saw Dr G's car! But maybe it would have sent some warning signals if I had. I'm really sorry you had to cancel this cycle. I haven't done an oestrogen only cycle or nat modified, but I would say from my experiences with letrozole that probably you don't want to take it on a natural modified cycle if your main aim is going to be to transfer. It could go either way, particularly if you have a history of struggling to thicken your lining. Theoretically it doesn't thin your lining as much as Clomid, but because it is reducing oestrogen early in the cycle, you will still probably have thinner lining than just stimms. I had to add so much oestrogen to get my lining up to 7mm on the cycles I did with letrozole. I have one blast left but it is a 6 day one so I am not very hopeful of its chances. I would rather try and collect another embryo or 2 before I turn 39!

    Offline katkat2014

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    Low AMH / High FSH Cycle Buddies - Part 6
    « Reply #1952 on: 13/02/19, 10:18 »
    Ugh I just realise I am constantly on this forum these days, must be desperation (and boredom at work)!

    Shady, thanks regarding the input on letrozole - ok will steer clear of it. It didn't thin my lining much on a mild cycle but I did take 150 gonal daily and just the one letrozole per day I guess... Now about your day 6 blast. I asked the clinic last time which of my blasts they think is better: the day 5 expanded blast (which was a 10-cell on day 3) or the day 6 hatching blast (which was an 8-cell on day 3) and I was told it is totally irrelevant at this stage what cell numbers they had and the important thing is they make it to blast on days 5 or 6. Also he could not give me the chance which one was better, the day 5 or 6 and he said they have an equal chance. Now if yours was even say an 8-cell on day 3, I think it does have a great chance to become a baby...

    Offline MSJ

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    Low AMH / High FSH Cycle Buddies - Part 6
    « Reply #1953 on: 13/02/19, 13:55 »
    Queenie - best of luck for your egg collection

    Shady- I'm so sorry for your BPN. There's a lot of bad news on this thread. I'm also sorry Dr G wasn't able to give you any clearer answers. At least you know he can't help you. I also find it annoying some clinics you have to ask them to monitor your progesterone level. I know I will have to at Create. Itís something quite simple to do but can make a big difference. Having too little can be an issue, but I donít know if too much progesterone would also be a problem though.

    Katkat - thanks for the tip on free scratches! I haven't come across Dr Quenby or Brosen but I might get in touch for the free scratches! Lol What I do know about all these well known doctors are that they do all seem to have big egos! Just wondering do Dr Quenby and Brosen give iVIG for uNK cells? And is it cheaper than Dr G?
    I understand your frustration with blasts not taking, I've had 4 blasts not take. At age of 42 I was still producing blasts, so I thought something must be going right with my eggs but I also know that even though they go to blast there maybe chromosomal issues. So the clinics were always quick to say to me it's probably egg quality due to my age. I hope your lining issues get resolved.

    Poppy you didn't misread my message, at my day 5 scan I hadn't had any stimms so I guess it was a natural scan. As I'm on a natural modified cycle with Create they don't give me stimms until day 5 so the only stimms I had was day 5-7 and trigger day 8 and collection on day 10. I haven't measured my FSH on this cycle I can only guess it's risen as I've been under so much stress and my boobs were hurting even after my period started. I also hadn't been doing anything to try and reduce my fsh so that probably didn't help.
    As for DQ Alpha I too didn't get a match with my partner, (thank god! As that would have been awful) and we are also from different backgrounds culturally. LAD is for  your paternal antibodies so I don't know if different cultural backgrounds will have a play on that.

    Helen I've had some immunes testing done at ARGC and Dr G. It is controversial and it is EXPENSIVE. However, I do have endometriosis and every literature I read points me in the direction of immunes issues. And for me the testing did give me some answers. For me it was just high NK cells and lower paternal antibodies. LIT treatment can help with implantation and protect the embryo. I haven't had a transfer since I had LIT, but I went to DR G after talking to a lady from the ARGC thread, she had history of miscarriages and failed IVFs at top US clinics and 2 at ARGC and after immunes treatment with Dr G at 41 she gave birth to healthy twins with no growth issues. Whether it's just luck or not I don't know but she sweared by the treatment she received from Dr G. And another lady had a preganancy and swears by the LIT treatment. I can't vouch for it myself as I've not had a transfer since and I feel like my situation is probably more complicated.

    AFM more bad news I'm afraid. I had egg collection yesterday on natural modified cycle. They collected 2 eggs. 1 was 18 and 1 was 14, so I had little hope for the 14mm one. Today I got a call that the 18mm one didn't fertilise. I am really gutted. I'm also surprised that the egg  grew from 10 mm day 5 to 17 mm on day 7 scan. I was taking 150 bemfola. And it only grew from 17mm on day 7 scan to 18 mm on day 10 at egg collection. I took Bemfola and cetrotide on day 7, then just cetrotide and trigger on day 8. This is the first time that we've not had fertilisation. Normally fertilisation is 100% and before I did natural they were making it to blast. My last natural was a top grade 8 cell grade 1 on day 3. My fear that all the stress at work and sickness may have effected egg quality  may have been true. And also the medication they put me on (Indometacin) is normally for people suffering from arthritis and gout! I didn't even know what questions to ask when I got the news. Are you able to ask if they knew if the lack of fertilisation is due to egg or sperm?
    I'm not sure if I should do my final freezing cycle straight away or wait for my surgery is over then work might be less stressful... I'm working from home today and tbh can't be a*sed to do anything today!!!

    Offline Briss

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    Low AMH / High FSH Cycle Buddies - Part 6
    « Reply #1954 on: 13/02/19, 16:02 »
    MSJ, I am so sorry, no fertilization is always very upsetting. I do not think anyone can tell you whether itís down to egg or sperm, could be either or even both. I do not think stress has anything to do with it tbh but illness could have an effect and certain medication as well. Not indomethacin though, I was taking it when I had my DDís egg collected. I agree with you that 7mm growth in 2 days is very uncommon. Are they sure it really was 18mm on day of collection? Why did they trigger you on day 8, did your LH started to rise? I have a feeling it might have benefited from 1-2 more days of growth before trigger. Is it common for you to have egg collection so early, day 10?

    Offline Briss

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    Low AMH / High FSH Cycle Buddies - Part 6
    « Reply #1955 on: 13/02/19, 16:22 »
    Kat, I personally would not do down reg for FET. I only have one experience with down reg but I could see the difference in how my body is struggling with hormonal support around implantation. Having said that when beta levels started to rise again my body somehow found a way to produce progesterone/estrogen even after I stopped all meds.  Besides even though I had more follicles growing my lining was the same as on natural cycles. Estrogen priming on the other hand did increase my lining by at least 1 mm even when I only had one follicle growing. My experience might be different to yours but my estrogen levels depend on the number of follicles. I personally struggle with the idea of taking too much synthetic estrogen for health reasons.

    Offline MSJ

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    Low AMH / High FSH Cycle Buddies - Part 6
    « Reply #1956 on: 13/02/19, 22:20 »
    Thanks Briss thatís reassuring that indomethacin wouldnít have effected egg quality. They triggered me on day 9 last time and collection on day 11. Previous conventional IVF I had trigger around day 10.  They did do bloods on day 8 and said theyíre ready for me to trigger. They were also thinking about triggering me at day 7 as follicle size was already 17mm but the bloods came back and estrogen wasnít quite high enough. I didnít question their decision or ask if LH had risen but Iím guessing it did as they were worried that I would ovulate before collection. I was getting a lot of ewcm on day 8 so Iím guessing thatís what happened. Iíll question the size of follicles at my follow up. Those were the sizes they told me they were, but Iím wondering if 17mm at day 7 was a mistake if at egg collection was only 18mm...

    I also wish they monitored me on day 6 and started me on cetrotide then if needed to avoided the panick on day 7

    Offline Briss

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    Low AMH / High FSH Cycle Buddies - Part 6
    « Reply #1957 on: 14/02/19, 13:39 »
    Been trying to get my gp to refer me to epu since Monday but no success so had to do another hcg this morning which continues to rise slowly (863 compared to 561 3 days ago) so I think a trip to A&E is in order. Also started brown spotting a little which is of concern considering hcg levels are still pretty high.

    Offline MSJ

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    Low AMH / High FSH Cycle Buddies - Part 6
    « Reply #1958 on: 14/02/19, 20:24 »
    Briss I'm sorry you're still going through this. Is the pregnancy definitely not viable? I hope you manage to get some answers at A&E.

    I think you may also be right that I may have been triggered a bit too early




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    Offline Briss

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    Low AMH / High FSH Cycle Buddies - Part 6
    « Reply #1959 on: 15/02/19, 14:15 »
    I am glad I went to A&E yesterday; obviously I had to wait for ages but at least I ended up in EPU and was very lucky with the gyno; she managed to find the pregnancy (2.5 mm!) inside the uterus which is hugely important to me. She even managed to see the yolk sac 1.3mm. Anyway HCG continues to be suboptimal but EPU does not really go by HCG. They told me they did come across full term pregnancies that had suboptimal HCG levels but they would not want to give me false hope. She also did not think I needed to go back on progesterone. She did not actually believe it does much anyway.  I am just going to wait and let it run its course. My brown spotting is much worse today so I do not think I have long to wait.

    One thing I take from the whole ectopic scare is that it is so much safer to transfer a single embryo. I have come across (and a bit too often than I expected) situations where ectopic was happening at the same time as a normal uterine pregnancy as a result of multiple embryo transfer.