* Author Topic: IVF/FET/IUI/Clomid at 40+ OWN EGGS ONLY - questionnaire  (Read 5650 times)

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Offline Efi78

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And bump..
Anyone else andwering these questions?


1.   How old where you when you started IVF? Any fertility issues besides age?
2.   How many cycles did you have?
3.   What meds and protocol did you use?
4.   Did you also take extra supplements?
5.   How many eggs were collected?
7.   Did you also have male factor?
8.   How many embryos did you get (3 day or 5 day)?
9.   How many did you transfer?
10. lining thickness?
11. BFP/BFN? If BFP after how many cycles?fresh or FET?
12. Any embryos left for freezing?
13. Did you ever manage a natural conception at 40+?
14. If unsuccesful, after how many cycles you decided enough is enough and moved to Donor/adoption/gave up?
15. Which clinic did you use?

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    Offline pauli

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    Hi Efi,
    1. I was 39 when we started investigations, I was 40 when I did my first IVF/ICSI cycle. I have a mild endometriosis which was discovered during the investigations (I had a laparoscopy).

    2. In total we did 6 cycles with OE

    3. I had long, short, flare protocols; used mainly Gonal F and Menopur (and antibiotics) during stimms. Then progesterone, steroids, clexane, aspirin before/after the transfer.

    4. I took loads of different supplements (but not DHEA)

    5. In 6 cycles I had between 8 Ė 14 eggs collected each time.

    7. During the investigations we discovered, we had a male factor Ė poor morphology, high DNA fragmentation, and MAR test showed sperm antibodies. Morphology has got better throughout the treatment (DH took supplements and significantly reduced cycling), we did not repeat the MAR test as it was not relevant for ICSI.         

    8. & 9. & 12. First 2 cycles: we had 2 embryos transferred on day 3 and nothing to freeze. Cycles 3 Ė 6 resulted in 2 or 3 blastocysts. When PGS tested (cycles 3 & 4), all 5 blasts were aneuploid, so no transfer. On cycles 5 & 6 we did not test and just transferred all blasts (2 and 3 blastocysts each time) with nothing to freeze 

    10. Lining was never a problem, always tri-laminar and above 10mm

    11. I got BFP on cycles 5&6, but miscarried early both times (at about 7 weeks and 10 weeks)

    13. No, never had a natural conception (before 40 it was most likely due to the problem with the sperm).

    14. We decided that after 2 miscarriages to moved to DE in 2019.

    15. Used different clinics in the UK and abroad     

    Good luck to everyone and lots of baby dust. XX 

    Amandacatherine

    • Guest
    Can I ask how do you decide that you could do donor egg? How did you manage to move on? Me and my OH have so many doubts and fears around that whole process.

    Offline pauli

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    Hi Cath
    Our journey is a bit different. For our cycles 3 & 4 we travelled to a clinic in the US. My sister was based not far from the clinic at the time and she has a success there at her first IVF attempt (with a donor sperm as she was single). She was 41, her fertility health was not great (history of cyst aspirations laparoscopies, severe endo) and her AMH was undetectable! But she had that one golden egg she needed.

    We had 2 cycles there in 2017, 5 blastocysts in total but all aneuploid when PGS tested, so no transfer. My sister did another cycle with my DH sperm, but that blast was also aneuploid. The clinic is small but with the latest technology, and a very experienced team. If I had unlimited amount of money, I would have probably taken sabbatical off work, and kept doing IVF cycles there until I found that golden egg. But that was not an option.

    1-2 months after our 2nd cycle the clinic got in touch and offered us DE free of charge! It was Christmas 2017 and each year they select a couple to give a Xmas gift like that. They do the matching before they offer DE to the intended parents. It was an egg-share. Donor eggs were split 3 ways we were the 3rd couple to receive 5 frozen eggs from the same donor. We got loads of information not only about the donor herself but also info on her parents and both sets of grandparents (physical characteristics, health, education, where they came from etc.) plus pictures of donor.           

    I just turned 42 and was not ready to give up on my OE yet. But at the same time I was very grateful for the gift. We liked everything about the donor, and obviously the fact that we did not have to pay for DE or the treatment itself was a special bonus. I just had to pay for drugs I needed for FET.

    We accepted the gift but delayed the treatment by a year. In that year I did 2 more OE cycles at another clinic abroad which were fairly inexpensive in comparison. I followed a very similar protocol, got same results Ė 5 blasts from 2 cycles. We did not do PGS testing, just transferred all: 2 blasts on one cycle and 3 blasts on another cycle and hoped for a miracle. Well, both cycles ended in miscarriages. Most likely it was dues to the chromosomal issue. We knew from the previous PGS cycles that 5 blasts tested were all abnormal.   

    So it was our plan: try OE cycles in 2018 and if no success, to move to DE treatment in 2019. I guess we were in a privileged position knowing we had 5 donor eggs waiting for us. That one year while we tried 2 more OE cycles gave us both enough time to accept the idea of DE and bring a sort of closure for my OE. I keep thinking of the health issues we have experienced in my family and that it might be the best thing for our child to have the genes of a donor. 
     
    In Jan 2019 we traveled to the US clinic, they defrosted 5 eggs, all 5 fertilized and we got 4 blasts on day 5. No PGS testing as donor was young, so straight to a transfer - 1 blast transferred and 3 blasts in a freezer. It was an amazing result as all 4 blasts were 4AA. I am currently pregnant, 18+ weeks with a boy, so far so good, still a long way to go, but hoping all will end up well. I cannot wait to see meet our boy now and what he will be like ;-) 

    I know it is a big risk to use DE and it is not for everyone. I do not have a single answer how you accept the idea of DE. For me it was a chance of having a family, letting go of the control, and hoping for the best result ;-). It seemed that it was meant to be when the clinic reached out to us with an offer of DE. I do not know if we would have actively pursued DE journey ourselves. We were not considering it at the time. I think you must be happy with whatever decision you make, to feel in your heart that you are making the right decision. Sorry if this does not make much sense.   
     
    Good luck to everyone on their journey xx 

    Amandacatherine

    • Guest
    Thanks for that Pauli, I agree with the letting go and hoping for the best, unfortunately am a bit of a worrier. Right now am feeling a bit down, was suppose to start my 3 banking natural modified cycles tomorrow but have contacted a very bad stomach bug so might have to cancel again. It is another month gone and at 44 every month matters. Going to see how I feel tomorrow but donít hold out much hope to be honest giving how I feel right and maybe better to wait till June as being sick and trying to do a cycle is very hard.

    Offline Efi78

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    CathA - one month is not going to make a difference. Better to take care of yourself. Are you cycling at the Lister or Care? I am doing an FET at the Lister mid June to beginning of July. Transfering a last 3BB blasto I have. Tbh I am sure itís going to be another epic failure.

    Pauli- beautiful story. It shows how unpredictable can life be and how it drives you to paths you had never thought of before

    So, I wonder if there is a 40+ that have had success with OE IVF. I have only heard about natural conception at 40+ with OE. This makes me wonder whether itís down to old eggs or the high dosages that we take during IVF. Well, in my case itís also male factor

    Offline Efi78

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    Bump to receive a few more answers

    1.   How old where you when you started IVF? Any fertility issues besides age?
    2.   How many cycles did you have?
    3.   What meds and protocol did you use?
    4.   Did you also take extra supplements?
    5.   How many eggs were collected?
    7.   Did you also have male factor?
    8.   How many embryos did you get (3 day or 5 day)?
    9.   How many did you transfer?
    10. lining thickness?
    11. BFP/BFN? If BFP after how many cycles?fresh or FET?
    12. Any embryos left for freezing?
    13. Did you ever manage a natural conception at 40+?
    14. If unsuccesful, after how many cycles you decided enough is enough and moved to Donor/adoption/gave up?
    15. Which clinic did you use?

    Offline Qpmz

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    1.   How old where you when you started IVF? Any fertility issues besides age? 41, no fertility issues apart from age

    2.   How many cycles did you have? 7 egg retrievalís with IVF or ICSI. 6 embryo transfers

    3.   What meds and protocol did you use? short protocols each time (no down Reg) Meds varied, tried full stim and mild.

    4.   Did you also take extra supplements? Yes, folate, ubiquinol, fish oil, probiotics, wheatgrass, vit D spray,

    5.   How many eggs were collected? 3 was my minimum, 10 maximum from my most recent cycles.

    7.   Did you also have male factor? No - samples are always within normal parameters (motility, volume, morphology) however just decided to do Sperm DNA fragmentation test which we are waiting on the results.

    8.   How many embryos did you get (3 day or 5 day)? Min 1, max 8, Usually had at least two reaching day 5 but sometimes transferred on day 2 or 3 so couldnít tell.

    9.   How many did you transfer? 3 when doing full stim, 1 when doing mild. I think more is better if you have then when 40+

    10. lining thickness? Always good with triple layer and good blood flow. Canít remember thickness but doctors were always happy with it.

    11. BFP/BFN? If BFP after how many cycles?fresh or FET? All BFN : (

    12. Any embryos left for freezing? No

    13. Did you ever manage a natural conception at 40+? Got one by accident at 39 with a previous partner. Early miscarriage.

    14. If unsuccesful, after how many cycles you decided enough is enough and moved to Donor/adoption/gave up? Might do one more if we can muster up the emotional strength and finances. Might try a FET and do an ERA. Will also await sperm DNA fragmentation and see if that was an issue all along. If so vitamins are supposed to improve it significantly.

    15. Which clinic did you use? Create and ARGC.

    Have also done immunes and I tried PGS once. I seem to respond well and make good looking embryos but they just donít stick : (

    Offline Butterfly158

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    Hello All, I just wanted to add the answers to the questionnaire and share my story as some of you (Margot and Efi) were cycling at the same time as my last cycle in Oct/Nov 17... after 2 years and 3 BFN IVF cycles, the last cycle we only got 2 eggs and I was fully convinced at that point it was all over and I had literally run out of eggs. I managed to convince James at the Lister to do a Laparoscopy in Dec 17 (Guy's had refused) due to some very mild mid cycle pain I had been having. Miraculously one month later, while waiting for my period to start so we could begin our next cycle I got a BFP. My little girl is 7 months now and at times I still cannot believe she is here. I am 41 and had truly started to give up hope.

    We were at the point of seriously starting to consider DE and to be honest, I feel sure I would have gone ahead with this option (even though my husband didn't want to). In my mind the potential negatives of using DE were far outweighed by the benefits of having another baby (we have a 4 year old) and sibling for our daughter. Of course it's such a personal decision and many of my friends in similar circumstances would not consider such a route but I don't think there is any way you would ever regret having a child, no matter how they were conceived but I always felt that if I didn't try and keep pushing then I would always wonder and might regret not trying even if it meant using a DE. My husband on the other hand wanted to 'move on' within a few months of starting to try as he couldn't take the stress of it all.

    Ive filled in the questions below as I always found it gave me hope and kept me going to hear success stories. I wish all of you they best of luck in whatever path you take and wherever this journey leads you xxx

    1.   How old where you when you started IVF? Any fertility issues besides age?
    39 - Low AMH of 3.6pmol. Only collected 2 eggs in last IVF cycle.
    2.   How many cycles did you have?
    Three
    3.   What meds and protocol did you use?
    SP on first 2 cycles, LP on last one. Highest dose of Menopur on all three
    4.   Did you also take extra supplements?
    800mg Ubiquinol every day for 3 months...
    5.   How many eggs were collected?
    9, 10 and 2
    7.   Did you also have male factor?
    No
    8.   How many embryos did you get (3 day or 5 day)?
    2 x 3 day on each cycle (including the last one where we only got 2 eggs but both fertilised and were transferred on day 3)
    9.   How many did you transfer?
    2 each time
    10. lining thickness?
    I cant remember but was good on each cycle
    11. BFP/BFN? If BFP after how many cycles?fresh or FET?
    Cycle 1 - BFN, Cycle 2 - CP, Cycle 3 - BFN
    12. Any embryos left for freezing?
    No
    13. Did you ever manage a natural conception at 40+?
    Yes - with drastically low AMH, increasingly sparse and irregular periods (convinced I am and was perimenopausal). She is 7 months old now!
    14. If unsuccesful, after how many cycles you decided enough is enough and moved to Donor/adoption/gave up?
    My plan was to do another 3 cycles - so a total of 6 with OE and then move to DE
    15. Which clinic did you use?
    Guy's x 2 cycles and The Lister x 1 - I found the Lister much better and much more open to 'trying' things. IF we had stayed at Guys (and my husband and I argued hugely over whether to move clinics - I won in the end) we would not have our baby as Dr. Khalaf stated that "there would be no benefit" to me having a laparoscopy. The Lister agreed to try it and I am 100% sure this is the thing that finally allowed me to get my BFP.

    Offline pauli

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    Cath, sorry to hear you are not well. But I agree with Efi, one month is not going to make a difference if you decide to wait until June for the next cycle. Modified natural cycle was something I never tried but remember reading about it and thinking if it could be the right approach for 40+ eggs. Wishing you that you will catch that one golden egg you need xx

    Efi, wishing you that you get BFP with your transfer in June! I know it is so difficult to keep faith after a number of failures. It is an impossible balance to maintain: on one hand trying to keep faith that the treatment will work but on the other hand we cannot afford to get our hopes too high in case it does not work and we come crashing down.

    Qpmz, sorry to hear about your struggles. You are right, supplements (vitamins C and E) can help with the elevated DNA fragmentation should that be the result of the test. You mentioned you did PGS, did you get euploid embryos? If yes, so you know that you transferred chromosomally competent embryos and they did not stick, ERA is a good idea. I remember reading here on FF about the ladies who finally managed to have health babies after they following their ERA results. Good luck!

    Butterfly, what a beautiful story about your little girl. I tend to agree with you that laparoscopy can help to get you pregnant. Somebody I know needed laparoscopy following a car accident. She was about 40, never pregnant. With her partner they accepted they could not get pregnant naturally and did not proceed to IVF. Following laparoscopy she fell pregnant naturally ;-). You were right to follow your instinct and change the clinic!