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Sunhsine, great you have one frozen today and while you're disappointed, it is a really good sign they are all still growing. Fingers crossed for Monday. I forgot, are you banking?

Briss - No worries :) Roeteln IgG are antibodies against rubella so I would say that's a good thing! Reprofit use this new thing, a kind of a microscope to see if they can see a spindle after egg retrieval. If they don't they will wait a little longer to find the right time to icsi the egg. I think spindle shows maturity. They are always able to tell me within 1-2 hours if the egg was definitely mature or if they need to wait. Once they told me while the egg looked mature when they stripped it off the shell, the microscope didn't detect the spindle so they didn't use the egg, saved us a vial of sperm and money. I know this does't resolve the issue that they wouldn't collect the egg at 8pm. I think they'd go as late as maybe 3pm but they tend to close up by 4. At least they are open 7 days a week. Not wanting to defend R., just thought I'd mention this. Cortisol shows stress levels, and I do think this must have shown as increased as you had to do so many scans and bloods before - it makes us a nervous wreck! Sorry no idea about the blood pressure.

Ross weehheeey that's great news!

Afm nothing much to say, all totally normal. I am planning my next trip, I just don't know if I should do bloods or save the money and just use FRER to confirm the inevitable? How early can I test on an FRER after a 3-day transfer of a slow growing embryo?
 

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Hey sunshine, I am only 5dp3dt. Will 11dp3dt be good to test? Bearing in mind that it was only a 5 cell and with my 8 cells I had a low bhcg (68) on 13dp3dt.  I've never used a frer after transfer except for once (and i regretted it as i tested on a cheapo and it was negative but then my period didnt come; wished I had known if I'd had implantation). I've always done bloods otherwise. Reprofit told me to wait the full 14dp3dt but I want to plan next steps and not delay af unnecessarily

Sorry you're having such a hard time with your eggs as I know this feeling so well,  you'd want 4 good eggs and not just 4 eggs, as what's the point of collecting more than 1 if the result is the same. I've been in this situation before but mine usually disappear before day 3 or aren't mature to start with so bearing in mind  that yours are still growing then they have a chance!
 

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Hey blue I also order zita west vitafem from amazon and will get them tomorrow. What I noticed after they were already dispatched is that the ingredients on the back were slightly different  to those I ordered before, like folic acid rather than folate which i need. Are yours the same? Also the packaging looked a bit different

Sunshine next steps for me would possibly be another natural EC. And yes I think anything can happen, usually the most unexpected of things! Willing your embryos to grow!

Briss I don't think R. Would be able to get bloods right away but then again maybe they do. I would just email them and ask about it if that would be a possibility.

Thanks for replies about bhcg / frer, will have a think about it over the weekend. Bloods just don't lie so in a way I favour them
 

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Oh sunshine that's such fantastic news that you got 3 frozen!

Ross, wishing you a speedy 2ww!

Briss that's really interesting to know what the sperm was like after thawing, I've never asked about it. What was the motility like before thawing the sperm again?

Babyhopeful hope your 2ww is going OK.  I have to say I am not really stressed at all as have written the cycle off before it had even started. I keep on forgetting that I'm supposed to be in a 2ww

Helen isn't sore boobs due to high levels of estrogen/ imbalance of hormones?

Afm talking about an imbalance of hormones, I've had night sweats this cycle for the last 4 days, I had them before but I cannot remember when. I think it was when I did my ERA when i used estrogen.  But on this natural cycle I didn't take any estrogen so I wonder if it's due to the utrogestan. But I usually take far higher doses of cyclogest and don't get night sweats....  Before anyone gets excited, on my only.bfp I didn't have night sweats either (instead I got acne and vivid dreams). Could high progesterone levels cause this or maybe just this particular brand (utrogestan)? Or would it be due to a sudden drop in estrogen causing this (but it wasn't a stimulated cycle and my estrogen was normally high before ovulation)? I am only taking 400mg of utrogestan per day whilst usually I take 800mg cyclogest plus injectables. It's just disgusting waking up drenched ...

By the way my zita west from amazon seem to be the right ones with folate in them - it was just that the image on amazon showed the wrong ingredients (folic acid)
 

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Klik, it must be so frustrating, when you just want to get on with a cycle and then these constant delays! I hope they miraculously can move the date to an earlier one for you. My night sweats have suddenly completely stopped at 8dp3dt. And i haven't been doing anything differently all of a sudden. Very odd!

Ross bloating is quite common after stimulation and then the hcg trigger shot but should go away with time. Just drink lots of water and eats lots of protein

Briss yes it's the Czech progesterone. I've only used it because it expires soon and I didn't want to touch the better cyclogest for this not so hopeful cycle.  Why or in what way did utrogestan impact the next cycle for you?  I have changed to cyclogest last night. What dosage so you usually take on your natural cycles?

Afm I've had night sweats from about 5dp3dt to 8dp3dt increasing daily and including a mild headache. Now it's totally gone. Of course despite Briss suggestion I haven't tested yet and regret it as am wondering now that it's stopped if it meant anything after all (?). When I do the blood test (yes!) possibly tomorrow or Friday then even if there had been something going on then it won't show anything at this late stage arrrghh! My otd isn't till Sunday actually
 

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Hi ross, I decided to do a blood test in the end as it is clearer - if you can afford it go for a blood test and you can do it a couple of days earlier. Actually I just remembered that  Dr Hana said otd is 14dp3dt, but that is for hpt only. For blood tests she said I can test 12dp3dt (Friday). For me, I never saw a second line on a hpt so I am terrified of them. I only wanted to do a hpt this time to save money on the blood test and because I think I will know the outcome anyway... But I changed my mind this week, so blood test it is :) I am thinking of doing it tomorrow only, because the clinic I do it with it takes them so long to get my results back and I am worried that if I test on Friday they won't tell me till Monday! if your embryo transfer was on day 3 and it was on 22nd January, then today you are 9dp3dt meaning 9 days post a 3 day transfer.
 

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Thanks briss. I am starting to get my usual pre-AF back ache ... Just hope taking the progesterone for so long hasn't screwed up my next cycle/follicle growth!

Tilly - are we meeting Saturday in a week's time? I've forgotten to bookmark the doodle poll site
 

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Tilly - the previous place we met works perfectly well for me

LXP, my left ovary is difficult to find  but in the end they do tend to get the eggs. Good luck!

Afm, I started spotting this morning and the bloods confirmed what I expected - bfn. I am ok with it as I didn't haev any expectations, what I am not ok is having to fly abroad again, having to fork out more money etc. It is just extremely stressful! I know it's due to the bad 5-cell embryo, but this aside, do you think a 7.4mm lining is good enough? I hope I get AF soon and not such a massive delay now. I had already reduced my progesterone intake this morning when I started spotting, so hope that won't have too much of an impact. No idea if egg collection or another transfer will be next. I have to play it by ear again
 

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Thanks briss and ross. Have done far too many transfers now. This must have been one of my worst embryos  but when even neither my 8-cells nor blastocysts ever implant.
.. If the decision of DE just wouldn't be so difficult!
 

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Just a quick one for babyhopeful - I am really sorry to hear your news today!  ^hugme^ big hug to you! There is not much I think I can say except for - I find it helps just to plan next steps straight away and focus on the next go  :-*
 

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Ross am really very sorry for you too!  ^hugme^ it's the more frustrating when you had such a good quality 8 cell transferred. But it just proves you can make good embryos so hope the next time will be your time

Briss what a surprise with the late fertilisation, it must have been a total roller coaster having to fly back there a couple of days later again. I am sorry for the bfn! I know you're sure that at 11dpo you'd be out, but don't you think there is an inkling of hope considering it was a slow developer? Even my 8 cell only gave me a 68 bhcg at 16dpo so at 11dpo a FRER wouldn't have detected anything I'd say in my case. I don't want to give you false hope though as equally I had an embryo fertilise a day late and nothing came of it. I hope in the case of a real bfn that you get af soon and can get on with the next try. Sending you lots and lots of energy - I know how draining it all is!

Klik in my opinion - bring your friend if it doesn't bore her!

Lxp great news about the fertilisation and let's hope for the other 2 to make it as well!

Mac, I keep on thinking of DE myself as well, it's so hard to give up on your own eggs right?. My dp actually said he'd rather do DS than DE which doesn't help me much as clearly there are millions of sperm in a sample (with good chances of finding a normal one) why I only produce genetically abnormal eggs it seems. My main concern is how to deal with telling or not telling, it stresses me so much having to make this choice and how to handle the situation in general (plus of course giving up on your genetics). I hope you don't need to make this choice!

MA66 I think 2 out of 3 eggs should fertilise in a 'normal' case. You have a great AFC! I cannot give you any ideas of how to get more mature eggs out of those follicle as this is the issue I've been trying to get to the bottom of for 3 years now myself, but I can say that for me the letrozole and gonal f combo gave me as many mature eggs as higher doses of FSH alone and that meant a cost saving to me and I generally felt better physically on those cycles.
Vit B is to balance the hormones and lengthen your luteal phase.

Welcome Laura!

Afm what's the advantage of taking estrogen after ET ( in addition to progesterone)? What is your take on endometrial receptivity on a 2-day transfer vs a 3- day transfer? I understand the lining on a 5-day transfer is best as this is when on a natural conception the embryo would arrive.
 

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Hey Helen, I can tell you what I had to do on my recent natural FET: I tested for peak on my opk (I also did a blood test of LH and estrogen, both were high and confirmes I would ovulate within 24 hours).and then went in for a scan 2 days after peak to confirm that I had ovulated. On this day I started progesterone. The much easier way however would be: do a scan on day 11 as well as blood test LH and estrogen. Give yourself a trigger shot whenever the follicle is say 18-20mm (in my case that is) and LH is not too high yet. Then you know for sure that you will ovulate 36 hours later and can safely say it is time for you to start progesterone that day and plan FET for your day 2,3 or 5 accordingly

Annakay I am really sorry to hear about your disagreement with your DH. It is very painful, I know that as my DP could also imagine just staying a family of two while it's me that doesn't want to give up on a child. But i think it is a process. While your DH may be totally against it now, with time he may consider DE or DS. Mine still is against it but I know he's coming round a tiny bit to the idea of DE or DS or EA - mainly as he doesn't want to lose me, also because he's tired of all this and it does really affect him too to get disappointment after disappointment. But I think it's really difficult to decide about any of this on your own as in essence that's what it is - we have to convince our other half about it while we're not 100% sure ourselves. In any case, you're doing the right thing in focusing on your egg collections for now. I just wanted to say you're not alone with your thoughts and situation and I do hope it works out for you. I can't help you with your question though I'm afraid as I don't have any experience of cysts other than they go away with my period usually. Could.you email your coordinator to say your Dr is on leave and if she could please ask Dr Pavel for assistance in the meantime as he was recommended to you by a friend?
 

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Helen, am sure you're already doing this but take high dose vitamin e, high dose selenium (and l arginine), if you can get hold of it then vaginal viagra twice a day (if you don't have it  then it would take too long to order it I think as it comes from somewhere like Singapore I think), legs up in the air, keep the blood flow going, take beetroot shots or get some raw beetroot and make some larges juices over the next few days. I can't really say this really helped me but it helped others. The only difference ever for me was the viagra. I think my follicle was the same size or a bit bigger than yours. 25x19 is only 22mm on average, that's not massive. In my case LH was about the same as yours and my estrogen was a bit lower. I ended up ovulating overnight, it didn't turn into a cyst. (briss ovulates when her LH is higher than what we both had; so maybe you do too and therefore haven't had a strong positive yet; it may also mean that your lining could still grow as I think it accelerates at the end before the follicle ovulates). Also, I used the One Step Midstream ovulation tests from Amazon and the day I did my bloods it showed the strongest peak I've ever had. Sometimes these cheaper tests are better! And I defo ovulated as the follicle was gone on my scan 2 days later. So I am confident you are about to ovulate, however maybe not imminently (?) considering the opk's. I hope your lining thickens enough. Have a glass of red tomorrow at the restaurant, it has antioxidants ;)

We also had quite a few rough patches throughout this IVF journey, for me that's become normal! The most recent one was about alcohol this week, i was furious he got drunk on Tuesday at his trade event. He called it 'but I had to go networking and really, I just needed to let my hair down'. I am such a whinging whining partner all the time these days, I wished I could just let it go and let him have his fun without feeling resentment or telling him off. He really hardly ever drinks anymore and this means he basically doesn't socialise anymore, it's just the two of us stuck together all the time, doing basically hardly anything as every penny goes to IVF. I feel terrible that I am reacting that way, but with my 42nd looming on the horizon I feel every minute counts. And he had promised he wouldn't get drunk :( is it so difficult to stop after 1-2 pints?! It's not for the rest of his life! Although admittedly it feels like it right now, for me too. Anyway runt over!

On a happier note - looking forward to meeting a lot of you again tomorrow. Was it around 18.30?
 

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It was so lovely to meet you again Tily, Klik and Shady, and great to meet Helen and Dorchester too for the first time! I can't believe we chatted for 5 hours again?! Sorry you weren't able to make it, Pickle, Cramer and Briss - hopefully the next time.

Tily, it's too early to trigger with this kind of oestrogen, I would wait another day if your LH is low. You can take cetrotide to hold off ovulation if your LH isn't too high yet. I believe letrozole causes lower estrogen though, so I think it would be lower in any case than if you hadn't taken it. But if you stopped letrozole then I would expect it to go up over the next couple of days.

Edit: I just googled this, your estrogen is definitely lower when using letrozole. Nevertheless I would wait another day if your LH allows it. You don't want to lose the egg though, so the LH level today is important

AFM: In need a typhoid vaccination for an Africa trip I will be going on in April. Does anyone know if this will impact follicular development? For example can I do it and then still do egg collection say 2 weeks or so after doing the vaccination?
 

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Just a quick note as I wanted to say that am really sorry Helen about the PGS result. It's not what you were expecting, but I don't think you can conclude from this to those you have frozen. This said, I have the same fears about my frozen ones so I totally understand you. Ah hey you can do it both - Job interview and transfer - if.you wanted to!

Babyhopeful, the DE line is a tough one, have heard it many times from my previous clinics although thankfully my reprofit doctor had never mentioned it again since I told him once that I'm not ready.  I really love him for it!
It really hurts when your friend suggests 'surrogate' I am sorry you dont get her support right now. I got the why don't you just adopt line many times from the same friend again and again until I asked her 'now why don't you adopt your second one' (she was just 3 months pregnant with her first one at that point) and that shut her up. I think your friend just wears pregnancy goggles right now, I am sure she didn't actually mean it in a mean way, she probably just didn't think properly  ^hugme^

Thanks for replies on the vaccination..I think I will just do it and then try and forget that I've done it and continue cycling
 

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Hey queenie, thanks for your reply / reassurance. That must be so difficult to juggle work/ trips as well as cycling at the right time. I do have a couple of trips now coming up in April and May so not sure how I will do it.

Afm where can I get the cheapest ovitrelle from? I was quoted prides of 38 and 45gbp, am sure it used to be 30 before. Ideally I'd want the cheaper pregnyl if anyone has an idea where I can get it from, my pharmacy has run out of stock now
 

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Thanks Tily. Will see if they sell to those not cycling with  them. Hope your bloods went well

Afm lining only 6mm, I think this entire cycle is out of sync for me, after the transfer last month. So not a good month for a natural transfer (was 7.5mm same time last month) so am planning to check again next month (or do a collection) once I am decided what to do about the typhoid shots
 

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Briss morning or evening doesn't matter but you need to leave at least 6 hours between it and the trigger shot. I would make it dependent on your LH levels as you don't want to take it too soon either
 

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Lxp am really sorry to hear about your recent cycle. I really am not sure what to suggest to be honest as I have no knowledge of stats of ivf versus natural conception if there are no obvious issues (other than low amh) . Just sending you a very big hug for now and hope your next cycle will work better.

Tilly after all the injections and scans and spending time abroad, this is just devastating! At every corner there  seems  to  be a hurdle! I can really feel with you not just for you.  I had a bit of a breakdown today too about OE vs DE... Just sending you a massive hug  ^hugme^  it's so unfair  :-[
 
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