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Mouse -  I had a friend who similalry felt it hadn't worked,  had cramps and reduced her medications and started to bleed - 2 days later she had a scan for what she thought was day 2 of her cycle and there was a very early embryo and gestational sac there.  She did a blood test and HCG was there but low, and re-started her progesterone, but becuase she had stopped it a few days earlier it was too late to rescue it. 

I'm sorry if i'm being unhelpful - I just want to say - have a blood test, you can always boost your hormones if it is a weak positive, but sometimes they need a little help maintaining right at the beginning. 
 

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So definitely a bfn for me this cycle. So onto the 1 frostie we have left over. This will be my 7th cycle this year and starting to feel like it will never work! But I know i need to just keep going and try and be persistent.

Hope everyone else is doing ok?
 

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Be kind to yourself Mouse - it's  long long road for all of us.

I personally wouldn't rush into transfering your last frostie - give yourself some head space to prep for it, and also to think about if there are any variables you haven't discovered which might be holding the embryo back. 
 

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Just a quick one for Mouse, I am so sorry this cycle did not work, bfns are always heartbreaking and so deflating after everything you went through to go all the way to transfer for it to end so quickly is truly disappointing. but you are still in the game, still have a cycle, follicles, eggs so the possibility is still there. When I get clean BFNs I first look at the embryos. if the embryo was good i.e. beautiful, i never held my embryos in the lab past day 3 so can only say that if on day 2 it's beautiful 2-4 cells or on day 3 it's 8 cells and they all look more or less the same size/shape - if the embryo is beautiful I would expect to see at least an attempt at implantation - a faint line, chemical, early mc - at least something. in which case i'd see it as encouraging in a way that everything works as it should we just need to carry on searching for a better quality egg/sperm (basically i'd put it down to embryo quality). but if you had a beautiful embryo that had no sign of implanting I'd look elsewhere i.e. implantation issues / uterus. it's a very simplified way to look at things but it worked for me. I regret (slightly) BF for so long because I transferred lots of good quality embryos that somehow did not implant because of BF. I have no way to prove it except that the only good embryo I transferred after I stopped BF did try to implant but it was my last embryo. I have not managed to make an embryo in a lab since then and am very sad         
 

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Thanks guys for your kind and encouraging words.

Briss I think you have a point about embryo vs implantation. In two years I have not even had a sniff of implantation and I would know as I tested early and consistently every month. I also no know that while I don’t produce many eggs, those eggs I do make have no problem making top quality blasts. So again to me this points to a uterus issue. I have a consultation next week and I will be asking about what investigations we need to do. I have long felt this has been an implantation issue but it’s difficult to justify “a hunch”. I suspect the consultant may say it’s age! He may be right but maybe not.

I’m so sorry you are feeling sad. You must feel exhausted by ivf, I can imagine it’s hard to stay hopeful at times. Are you still thinking of trying a different clinic?

Today has been a difficult day. Just allowed myself to feel sad. It will pass but just need to let myself feel sad before I can start again.

Hope everyone else is ok. Xx
 

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Go with your gut.  If you are making top quality blasts there is a >80% chance they are chromasomally normal, and therefore it is likely to be something other than the embryo which is causing the problem. - You can't be sure, but I would definately guess there is something you are missing which, if you treat will make the difference.
Problems can be multi-factorial.  I am sure we had implantation issues as well as DOR/MF.

I would test for endocrine clotting and immune factors :-
Thyroid (TSH should be <2.5)
Immunes (Chicargo tests or others).
Anti-Phsospholipids
Thrombophillia

Then more uterine factors :-
Hysteroscopy (At a good clinic) & ERA.
Possibly also - Hidden C
 

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Mouse, sorry that you got bfn, they are so hard but agree that you need to follow your gut and check other issues atleast to put your mind at rest.

We are at a point now where people from our NCT group are starting to announce 2nd pregnancies, despite being grateful every time I look at my daughter its still hard. My cycle isn’t that regular since having her, its always been short (23 days) but was always perfectly regular, now it can be anything from about 19 days. I’m hoping after xmas we can ttc a bit more as at the moment I’m still working on postnatal recovery though do try to bd atleast once around ovulation. Still not planning to go back down the IVF route so will just have to focus on whatever I can do to give myself the best chance naturally, hopefully i can find something to help balance my hormones for now.
 

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Hi all,

Hope everyone is doing ok in these challenging times!

Not sure if anyone is still around on this thread but just looking for a bit of advice as you are all so knowledgable.

After my last double embryo transfer that resulted in a bfn I asked the consultant about investigations for implantation failure. We agreed the best plan was to have a hystersonography scan (saline/Aqua scan). This was to check the cavity etc. This was all clear and I continued with meds for FET. However after 20 days on estrogen tablets and pessaries my lining was not moving beyond 5.5mm. The consultant now thinks I should have a hysteroscopy to rule out any small scarring before we transfer this embryo. It’s so so expensive and just wondering whether you think it’s worth it? I was surprised he suggested this after the normal scan but he thought perhaps it missed something more minute.

I only have this one blast in the freezer and don’t want to put it back if implantation is an issue but I’m in two minds.

Any thoughts would be gratefully  received.
 

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Hi Mouse, I would follow your gut here, if this is your last embryo and it didn’t work would you always regret not getting it done. Before my successful transfer I had a hysteroscopy with the implantation cuts in Athens done. It may have worked anyway, who knows, but it was such hard work to actually make any embryos I just didnt want to potentially be wasting them. I know its so hard knowing whats best to do.
 

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mouse80 said:
Hi all,

Hope everyone is doing ok in these challenging times!

Not sure if anyone is still around on this thread but just looking for a bit of advice as you are all so knowledgable.

After my last double embryo transfer that resulted in a bfn I asked the consultant about investigations for implantation failure. We agreed the best plan was to have a hystersonography scan (saline/Aqua scan). This was to check the cavity etc. This was all clear and I continued with meds for FET. However after 20 days on estrogen tablets and pessaries my lining was not moving beyond 5.5mm. The consultant now thinks I should have a hysteroscopy to rule out any small scarring before we transfer this embryo. It's so so expensive and just wondering whether you think it's worth it? I was surprised he suggested this after the normal scan but he thought perhaps it missed something more minute.

I only have this one blast in the freezer and don't want to put it back if implantation is an issue but I'm in two minds.

Any thoughts would be gratefully received.
Hi Mouse80,

Sorry to jump in here and I have been reading your post. I just had hysteroscopy on Monday and my insurance paid for it. There is no need to say for fertility. I am doing it before my FET plus ERA. It will be my first FET so want to tick as many boxes as I can before.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

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Just to add I had hysteroscopy and consultant advised laparoscopy too. After failed DE cycles with perfect embryos.

Good job I had the laparoscopy too as hysteroscopy found a perfect cavity but outside there was endometriosis and nasty cysts on my ovary. All removed.

But if you’re having a hysteroscopy you may as well have laparoscopy too And a D&C. Recovery is days. And it’s far more beneficial from a diagnostic point of view. And most gynaecologist consultants would suggest both anyway especially those dealing with fertility stuff. 

Covered on health insurance too. As my symptoms were pain.
 

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Thanks for the replies. I don’t have health insurance so will be paying and it’s quite expensive. However I think it’s worth it to rule out any cavity issues as it’s taking 6 cycles to get 3 blasts so I should make sure that everything is ok before transferring the last one as not sure I can do six more to get such small numbers!

Does anyone know how long it takes for a period to arrive after a cancelled medicated fet?

Thanks all
 

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Sorry, just catching up only a little--I'm missing out loads of people, and for that I apologise:

@queenie: everything crossed for continued good news! May UCLH continue to treat you well...

@Briss: I really hope you find something that manages to get your fertility back on track. I am sorry it's been so frustrating...

@Sunshine: have you stopped breastfeeding (assuming you were doing so to begin with)? I really scared myself taking my basal body temperature as soon as I got my periods again, and they were just plain weird. Temperature wouldn't go up until I was already well into the luteal phase! It only seems to have normalised one cycle ago, and it was either because it was 3 months post-weaning, or because I was put back on thyroxine, or some combination of both, or something else entirely... I was so relieved to go back to some normality!

@mouse: my baby came from a natural conception immediately after a hysteroscopy to check that adhesions had indeed been resolved by a prior adhesiolysis. I really don't know your history, but with persistent thin lining (especially if your lining used to get thicker), I would personally investigate for adhesions, unless I really could not afford it...

afm: baseline scan yesterday, starting to prep for a potential FET. Ho, hum. I really didn't miss this--I am, as ever, admiring of all of you...
 

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Kilk hi and thanks for posting on here. Where are you doing your FET? That good you can get it in before Xmas hopefully?

I decided to go with the hysteroscopy and booked in for Tuesday. It might be clear but at least then I will know for sure.

Feels like it’s a long wait till I can start my FET in jan. Am very bored or lockdown and the last year of covid and constant ivf means my chat is generally pretty dire! I’m also heading toward my 40th next month which doesn’t feel great but just going to have to tell myself it’s not going to matter too much for the ivf.

Hope everyone else is doing ok.
 

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Hi All,

Just to update you I had my 20wk scan yesterday, and largely all good - little boy alive and kicking in there!
Unfortunately I have a few markers for higher risk which, means more scans and monitoring!  Isn't it annoying that some of the reasons it is tricky to get pregnancy are also possible probelms for babies development? 
Anyway,  I had stopped the beetroot and pomegranate smoothies after the first trimester - now back on them again, as well as the asprin and heprin - yeah for sticky blood!

Mouse - sounds like you are getting everything checked out before using that embryo,  totally support that.  Embryo's are prescious, and if you need to spend a bit on omptimising the environment before putting it back you should do it. 

Klik  - I am so excited for you,  how is it going, when is your transfer?

Sunshine -  I found the combination of macca and vitex really helped me, (clear nasty oestrogens and ostrogen breakdown products and also stabalise FSH a bit). 

 

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Queenie so pleased your 20wk scan showed a kicking baby. Sorry to hear you have to have more monitoring.

I had my hysteroscopy last week and it was all clear, no scaring in there at all. Waiting on biopsy but think it will be fine. So plan to start this fet in January with estrogen patches, pessaries and tablets along with baby aspirin to try and thicken the lining.

Was going to try and take the aspirin while ttc naturally over the next few months. Assuming this should be ok.

Hi to everyone else and hope you are all doing ok.

Also just wondered has anyone considered whether they will get the covid vaccination? The advise is not to have if it if you’re planning on getting pregnant in the next few months but I’m front line nhs professional so feel like I really don’t want to catch covid in the middle of ivf for obvious reasons. Hard to know what to do for the best.

 

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Mouse - Pleased for your hysteroscopy.  I take 150mg of Asprin once a day at night.  It's often recomended for older women anyway.

My sister who is 28 was ttc for 9 months without sucess and took Asprin, next month she was pregnant, i expect my sister has the same thrombophillia mutation as me.  If you aren't going to have the advanced thrombophillia tests then taking Asprin is definately something I would be considering,  it can help stop the proteins sticking to the lining of the uterus and blocking attachment in the implantation phase - but depends if this is a problem for you or not. 

Did you have any of the other tests, APL / Immunes etc. ?

On Covid,  I would have the Pzier one personally either before pregnancy or breastfeeding,  I would avoid during pregnancy just to be safe.  It works against the mRNA, there isn't a plausible mechanism by which it would be problematic beforehand.
 

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Happy New Year ladies! i hope 2021 will bring us lots of joy and happiness!

sorry I have not been here much, I've been trying to learn how to accept whatever's coming but I am struggling. I tried and tried to work out if I still have ovulation but no LH surge can be detected. I still have period but I never know if it's going to come or not. I have been to Athens and met Penny, she is really lovely. I did another uterine blood infections test, they think i have low level of lactobacillus which means i might have too much "bad" bacteria. anyway, I am about to start a very heavy AB treatment which I do not mind. Although I still think Penny focuses too much on uterus while my issue clearly (at least to me) lies with ovaries. 2020 was a disappointing year in terms of fertility treatments, i only managed one egg collection in Munich and zero eggs was collected. My latest BFP was two years ago now. No chance for IVF travel any time soon with how things stand at the moment, not that I can find any sign of ovulation anyway. Penny urged me not to do any more stims at all. She firmly believes slowly and naturally is the way to go. she might be right here. she also did not think I was a candidate for stem cells treatment, she did not mind me doing it but she just was not convinced it's for me. I might agree with her in terms of stims though. I had a very heavy stim overload for about two years and ended up with very "lumpy" breasts (before you ask, all clear I did monitor at a private breasts clinic for about 18 months and will continue to monitor). No idea if there is any connection but the change in how my breast feels happened around the same time and very quickly ( I do think 1-2 years is not too long). i am pretty sure it's hormonal cos my progesterone is definitely lacking or out of balance.

I could not watch the christmas special of call the midwife, it pains me too much. Menopause is a loss of something precious. Women are amazing actually, I cannot imagine men ever being able to cope with such a loss.

speaking of men, my DH finally started 3 months off beer and also agreed on a heavy AB treatment. I think we will try to freeze his sperm in Athens next year and I might move to cycle with serum. no idea how this is going to play out considering covid/brexit situation.   
 
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